If we are to become like angels upon our physical deaths, what happens to free will? Angels do not have free will, so do we lose ours when we die?

I believe angels do in fact have free will. Otherwise, how would 1/3 of the angelic host become fallen angels? Did God tell them to disobey Him?

The fact that you would swallow anything the Bible says about God, despite the fact that your own moral compass leads you to believe that such behavior is wrong, is telling. To me it says that the paper and ink holds more authority than even that still small voice.

  Great one, Baker!

Like I've said on other religion threads on this site, it seems funny that people strain at a gnat about biblical points while swallowing the camel of confusion . . . to use the Lord's own example. Many of you are simply parroting the philosophies of men, mingled with scripture.

What sets apart angels from us is that we can be forgiven and restored, and they can't. To follow God or not was a one-shot deal for angels, as far as we can tell. 1 Peter 1:12 says that angels "long to look into these things" (salvation and grace), which are not available to them. (Susan Bohlin)

Like I've said on other religion threads on this site, it seems funny that people strain at a gnat about biblical points while swallowing the camel of confusion . . . to use the Lord's own example. Many of you are simply parroting the philosophies of men, mingled with scripture.

I beleive I have made it quite clear, that the Hall of Souls is NOT in biblical scripture. Why continue to rant on this?

Like I've said on other religion threads on this site, it seems funny that people strain at a gnat about biblical points while swallowing the camel of confusion . . . to use the Lord's own example. Many of you are simply parroting the philosophies of men, mingled with scripture.

I beleive I have made it quite clear, that the Hall of Souls is NOT in biblical scripture. Why continue to rant on this?

The fact that you would swallow anything the Bible says about God, despite the fact that your own moral compass leads you to believe that such behavior is wrong, is telling

Hear, hear. I can’t resist sharing the views of one particular bloke, who lost faith in fundamentalist Christianity when he began to see things more clearly. Even though he turned from one extreme to the other, from fundamentalist to atheist, I believe he could have struck more of a balance, and simply let go of his stifling belief in Biblical inerrancy, or at least let go of his adherence to extreme Biblical literalism.

In his book, ‘Losing Faith in Faith’, former preacher Dan Barker writes :

"It is interesting to read the Bible now, with new `eyesight' so to speak. I used to read all the ugly parts of the Bible, but for some reason they were invisible, even beautiful. I was taught that God was perfect, loving and righteous -so there could be no question in my mind of his character. Any apparent contradictions or ugliness could be ignored in the faith of the `mystery' of Gods ways. I'm glad those days are over."

In chapter 29 of his book, Barker sums up a typical portrayal of the Biblical God:

"Dear Believer, You ask me to consider Christianity as the answer for my life. I have done that. I consider it untrue, repugnant, and harmful... The Biblical god is a macho male warrior. Although he said "Thou shall not kill", he ordered death for all in opposition (Exodus 32:27), wholesale drowning and mass exterminations; punished offspring to the fourth generation (Exodus 20:5); ordered babies to be smashed and pregnant women to be ripped up (Hosea 13:16), demanded animal and human blood to appease his angry vanity; is partial to one race of people; judged women inferior to men; ordered a man to be stoned to death for collecting firewood on the Sabbath (Numbers 15.32-36), is the sadist who created a hell to torture unbelievers; created evil (Isaiah 45:7)... sent bears to devour forty-two children who teased a prophet (II Kings 2:23-24); urged parents to kill their teenage sons for being drunk (Deuteronomy 21.18), punished people with snakes, dogs, dragons, drunkenness, swords, arrows, fire, famine, earthquakes and infanticide; and said fathers should eat their sons (Ezekiel 5:10) Is that nice? Would you want to live next door to such a person?...Do you see why I do not respect the biblical message? It is an insulting bag of nonsense. You have every right to torment yourself with such insanity --but leave me out of it."

Even though Barker gets somewhat emotive toward the end, I think his reaction is understandable. In my opinion, it’s only a matter of time before humanity grows out of extreme religious fundamentalism and adopts a more mature and rational interpretation of central religious revelations. These interpretations will make sense of reality, and will be more aligned with our inner-compass and wisdom, which affirms that God is love.

Dear Believer, You ask me to consider Christianity as the answer for my life. I have done that. I consider it untrue, repugnant, and harmful... The Biblical god is a macho male warrior. Although he said "Thou shall not kill", he ordered death for all in opposition (Exodus 32:27), wholesale drowning and mass exterminations; punished offspring to the fourth generation (Exodus 20:5); ordered babies to be smashed and pregnant women to be ripped up (Hosea 13:16), demanded animal and human blood to appease his angry vanity; is partial to one race of people; judged women inferior to men; ordered a man to be stoned to death for collecting firewood on the Sabbath (Numbers 15.32-36), is the sadist who created a hell to torture unbelievers; created evil (Isaiah 45:7)... sent bears to devour forty-two children who teased a prophet (II Kings 2:23-24); urged parents to kill their teenage sons for being drunk (Deuteronomy 21.18), punished people with snakes, dogs, dragons, drunkenness, swords, arrows, fire, famine, earthquakes and infanticide; and said fathers should eat their sons (Ezekiel 5:10) Is that nice? Would you want to live next door to such a person?...Do you see why I do not respect the biblical message? It is an insulting bag of nonsense. You have every right to torment yourself with such insanity --but leave me out of it."

Good Lord this is a different view! Put like this he sounds dreadful and cruel, someone to be feared. What an eye opener.

I beleive I have made it quite clear, that the Hall of Souls is NOT in biblical scripture. Why continue to rant on this?

Sorry Xythe, just seen your comment. I should have posted that last one on another article,

Good Lord this is a different view! Put like this he sounds dreadful and cruel, someone to be feared. What an eye opener.

Yes, I think that deep down we all know God is not dreadful and cruel, and we can afford some healthy breathing space from extreme Scriptural fundamentalism. That goes for all religions,

....someone to be feared.

Now you know what they mean by the "fear of God".

Unfortunately...off-topic.

Did you find anything valuable on the Guf or The House of Souls, which as previously stated several times is in fact NOT biblical...and this, not a condition of bible errancy.

So, why continue to rant on this off-topic subject?
Seek the Koran where there actually is reference to the Seventh Heaven.

Sorry Xythe, just seen your comment. I should have posted that last one on another article,

Not a problem Andy. Do you have any thoughts on the House of Souls, also known as the Guf?

Hmm, okay...honestly I didn't read all the above comments or I'd be here awhile. So, I'll just comment without consulting the rest of the answers.

The Hall of Souls seems a good possibility for the Judeo/Christian religions. Hall of Souls also leads me to think about Valhalla in Norse Mythology were good warriors and the like go after they die to become Einherjar(I think I spelled that right). I'm really not good with religion...I find it too...shall I say preachy and boring. I mean, people have ruined the stories in the Bible....I already know what happens and that leads to the decrease in my desire to actually read it...and it's not very exciting except when you get to Armageddon stuff. I usually check out other mythologies because they're so rich in story and fun to discover. Now don't get me wrong, I am a Christian, so don't go thinking I'm a pagan. I just find those other stories are just interesting....specifically Norse, Greek, and Egyptian. Anywho, back to the topic at hand...I believe that all souls were created at once....and are probably residing in a limbo like suspended state. They are then incarnated in a body of flesh and blood and thus spend life on Earth. There may be potential for reincarnation...a past lives kind of thing. Perhaps people get bored and decide to give life another run...or they didn't live a satisfactory life the first time (or few times) around. I'm very open to different views and no one will ever really know until they're dead and meeting the heavenly entourage themselves.

Well, that's all for me, folks.

~Zoo

I usually check out other mythologies because they're so rich in story and fun to discover.

I think so as well. Thats why I chose this topic, it's full of mystery and mentioned in several faiths. I was hoping to get some of those from the Muslim faith in on this one as I am little versed in that religion. Besides, I have heard the 7th heaven is in fact mentioned in the Koran, which btw I have never read. I am inclined to buy a copy of the Koran as a referrencel

I just find those other stories are just interesting....specifically Norse, Greek, and Egyptian.

Zoo, you should check out the book Popol Vuh. It was the scripture of the Maya-Quiché people of Guatemala. It's an absolutely fascinating read!

Zoo, you should check out the book Popol Vuh. It was the scripture of the Maya-Quiché people of Guatemala.

I'm familiar with the Hunahpu myth...it was in a novel I read this summer...but I'll try and get ahold of the Popol Vuh...maybe they have one here at the University. Hmm...

~Zoo